Martial Arts First Aid Kit Interview

Do you want to know how to heal your accumulated martial arts injuries? Listen to the following interview with The Knee Pain Guru, Bill Parravano about The Martial Arts First Aid Kit:

Brad Scornavacco:
Hi, everybody. Welcome back, and welcome to today’s call.

This is Brad Scornavacco. I’m the Head of School at Systema Colorado. My guest today is fellow Systema instructor, Bill Parravano, known as “The Knee Pain Guru.”

Today we’re going to talk about healing in the martial arts. But before we get to that, I just want to say hi, Bill. Why don’t you start telling everybody on the call today how you got involved in the martial arts in the first place. What drew you to martial arts training?

Bill Parravano:
Hey, Brad. Thanks a lot. I was interested in martial arts for the sheer principle of body mechanics. Being able to protect myself. Kind of that deeper searching for the sense of knowing what to do in a confrontational situation, or if something happened. That was my real draw to [martial arts training].

It was actually Judo that I got involved in first, and that was my real draw initially. There was such a sense of understanding body mechanics, and how you can position yourself to put your opponent or the person you’re working out with at such a significant disadvantage using leverage and physics and things like that, that it really fascinated me.

Brad Scornavacco:
You said you started doing Judo. How did that lead you to other martial arts? When everybody gets into martial arts, they have certain things that interest them, like you said. That really attracts them about that, and then kind of leads them into a direction because  a lot of people do multiple martial arts now.

So talk a little bit about where your path went starting with Judo, and onto other different martial arts because  obviously you’re a Systema instructor.

Bill Parravano:
To be honest, I wasn’t interested in other martial arts until after I blew up my knee. I had gotten into Judo, and loved Judo and throwing people and that whole concept. I wanted to go as deep as I could in Judo to understand those concepts and principles of Judo that created such force, that you could throw somebody on their back, or over your hip, or with a hand or leg technique. I wanted to go really deep with that, and understand that on a deeper level.

I started Judo in 1990. I traveled and competed on a regional and national level throughout the United States, and was reasonably successful. That came to an end when I blew up my knee, which was in December of 1998. I tore the l ligament in my left knee, and ended up dislocating my left knee four times. Which [is why] my reevaluation of what I was doing the martial arts for, and why I was doing it suddenly changed.

Brad Scornavacco:
It sounds like a major turning point in the way you looked at training and working in martial arts. I’m sure you had a lot of other bumps and scratches, and nicks and bruises and things from eight years of Judo. But then getting to that point where you had such a traumatic injury, do you look at that as something that led you to the healing arts? Or had you been doing healing before that, and they kind of mixed? Or is that something that then got you started at that point?

Bill Parravano:
At that point I had been going to different practitioners of different modalities — Chiropractic, massage, etc. I had tried different systems of energy work.

But it was more for me to experience it; not for me to learn it. I read books and things like that, but it didn’t go too deep because  Judo, as far as I was able to tell, didn’t have a healing component to it. Sure, there was warming up, stretching, rolling around and breaking a sweat. But there really wasn’t an understanding of how the systems in the body worked, and tying that into how we can relax the stress and tension in our body, which is huge.

Brad Scornavacco:
You said you got involved in all these different modalities, and started looking at having it help you. Being exposed to all these different healing ideas, how did that synthesize itself? How did you become “The Knee Pain Guru”? Was it because of your own knee injury that made you focus on that? Or did you see something as that was such a common thing, and that became your area of focus?

Bill Parravano:
It was from my own knee injury. After I blew out my knee, I had reconstructive surgery. They did a patella replacement (which is where they sliced part of my patella tendon; the patella, of course, is the kneecap), and put a pin in the bone in my lower leg, and a pin in my upper leg, and reattached this makeshift ligament that I had torn. They had also taken out a couple pieces of meniscus.

After the surgery I did three months of physical therapy, and they said, “You can wear this big titanium knee brace, and you can go back to Judo if you want.” But that’s no fun. In Judo you can’t do an on-lock or anything like that, because you’ll cut somebody’s head off with this titanium brace. The knee felt unstable and it would still swell.

There were so many dynamics about it, that I didn’t feel like I could show up on the mat and be a complete Judo player. I was 29 years old, and was looking at becoming one of the old black belts that stood off on the side, and was directing people on how they can compete and throw and things like that, and just didn’t cut it for me.

So I started looking at other things to do, because I couldn’t train as much or as hard as I used to because  now the way I was compensating for my knee, my back would go out, my neck would go out. I would have problems with my shoulders. It was the symptom of what people would look at and say “old age”, or just what to expect when you had been doing martial arts for 10, 15, 20 years.

It was like well, this is kind of bullshit. This is not how I want to operate. I didn’t want to be one of those (and you’ve seen them) old martial artists, the old Judo sensei that walks in and kneels down in front of the group, and he’s got one leg jacked out to the side because he can’t bend his knee fully. I was 29 years old, and it’s like that’s not going to work.

Brad Scornavacco:
At the same time you see people in various martial arts, for whatever reason are that older martial artist who is in phenomenal physical shape, and everything does work. Right?

Bill Parravano:
Right.

Brad Scornavacco:
You see people who have stumbled across something that has gotten their body to work throughout the course of their life, and actually function. That’s one of the things that appealed to me about what you do; is that there are ways for you to age and have your body work until you die.

Bill Parravano:
I do believe there is a very small percentage of people who, maybe for genetics or something else, can get away with whatever they’re doing and be older. They can be in their ‘50s and ‘60s and still be fine. However, for the most part you have people in their ‘20s, ‘30s, ‘40s who, as they get older, more stress and tension is building up in the nervous system. The injuries begin to add up. The ankle you sprained when you were a teenager, you sprained again when you were in your [early] ‘20s and again in your late ‘20s, and all of a sudden you have this compensation pattern going up into your hips and back, and it builds up.

Now when you go to practice you’re not really thinking about training; you’re thinking about how am I going to get through this so I don’t injure myself and I can go to work the next day?

Brad Scornavacco:
Yes, exactly.

Bill Parravano:
Or I could be there to play with my kids, and do those kinds of things. The focus goes away from the actual training of the art, and more towards this damage control maintenance on our bodies so we can kind of make it to practice, and sort of do something so we don’t jack something up again.

Brad Scornavacco:
Then you’re more and more afraid as you’re training with that mindset. People are training and they’re thinking, I’m going to train but I don’t want to hurt myself, and they wind up trying to protect their injury instead of overcoming it.

Bill Parravano:
And it’s no fun. Who wants to train like that? It’s not anything that’s enjoyable. The whole reason you enjoyed martial arts was to have that freedom of movement, and being able to experience the potential of what you can create out of a technique, a move or whatever it is.

What ends up happening is now we get into this fear pattern of less movement, more restriction, more limitations – both in our mind and our bodies. What ends up happening is we can’t pull out techniques anymore. Or those techniques are only for young people.

Brad Scornavacco:
You mentioned earlier that when you had your own injury you went through physical therapy. Obviously you’ve seen what the average person would go through if they get an injury and wind up having to go to therapy.

As “The Knee Pain Guru,” how does your approach in what you do differ? If I hurt my knee and went to the therapist down the road who goes through the run-of-the-mill school, how would that differ than if I went to you? What would you do with me that would be different?

Bill Parravano:
The big piece that is being overlooked that I don’t see many therapies out there talking at all about, is addressing the source of the issue. Any time we experience pain, restriction of movement, discomfort, burning, shooting – whatever that experience is in your body, it’s a function of your body tensing to protect itself from being injured further.

It’s a natural response. If someone sticks you with a pin, your body is going to cave around that needle and move away from it. It’s going to tense up to protect itself, and as we tense up, we generally hold our breath and move away from the injury, which is what we do with a sprained ankle, a jammed thumb, or an arm lock. We immediately tense up and hold it and protect it.

The pain you experience is the nervous system’s natural response to that injury. By creating comfort around that injury, by taking the pressure off those nerves in the area of the body that’s created the restriction, you create space. Which immediately reduces the pain the body experiences. Everything else is smoke and mirrors. You can diagnose it as being something.

Now if there’s a mechanical dysfunction (meaning you have a broken bone, torn ligament, torn muscle, rotator cuff, whatever it is), yes, that needs to heal first. However, what I’m talking about is when that is healed, the body is still protecting from that old injury. That the injury is no longer there.

And this is what causes the dysfunction I’m talking about. By creating comfort around that, you begin to create space which frees up the nervous system, which frees up the tension pattern that allows the body to move more naturally and free.

Brad Scornavacco:
If somebody was going to do physical therapy and not have that element of creating comfort around the injury again, would you said that might exacerbate the injury and make a worse or stronger response to protect the injury that might inhibit doing them?

Bill Parravano:
Absolutely. If you focus on building muscular strength in order to balance the body back out, that has a certain degree of benefit. However, what I see most physical therapy doing, is creating more of a dysfunction and tension pattern. More problems. More restriction in the movement, because they’re not looking at the effect on the nervous system. The effect on the impinged nerves that are sending a signal to the brain that knee pain, or whatever part of the body hurts, is having problems.

And they’re not looking at breath because  you can control the tension in your nervous system through breathing. The sympathetic/parasympathetic nervous system response (sympathetic is fight, flight or freeze; and parasympathetic is rest and relax). You can directly control that tension in your nervous system through breathing.

If you are incorporating creating space to take the pressure off the nerves, and looking at breathing simultaneously, you’re leaving 99% of what’s causing the dysfunction on the table.

Brad Scornavacco:
It sounds like therapy is trying to build everything up around the injury and the pain without ever just making the injury go away, or have it heal. Like you’re saying, with all this muscle work and everything else, it’s like you’re building these walls around it. But then it will never, ever actually get better. They’re protecting everything else.

Bill Parravano:
A perfect example is if you have something going on with your lower back. You had a rough practice the night before, and you wake up the next morning and your lower back hurts. You go to the doctor or the physical therapist, and they say, “You need to strengthen your stomach muscles.” Well, think about it. It wasn’t like you went to bed the night before and your stomach muscles suddenly got weak in eight hours of sleep and you wake up with back pain.

By strengthening your stomach muscles, you actually reinforce the dysfunctional tension pattern that’s going on in the lower back. So you do more crunches, more leg lifts, and you build up more strength in your stomach. Now it creates more pressure and tension in your lower back.

A couple months later you get more back pain and you go to the doctor, and the doctor is diagnosing you with a herniated disc, because you reinforced an already dysfunctional tension pattern. So the key isn’t to strengthen the muscles more in your stomach; it’s more relaxing the tension pattern that is putting the pressure on the lower back.

Brad Scornavacco:
That seems to be the approach. For some reason everybody thinks that if you just make your abs stronger your whole body will be better, and what you’re saying is that’s not necessarily the case.

Bill Parravano:
Build your core. It sounds great and all well and good. However, if you’re building your core and you’re tensing up and holding your breath, you’re increasing the tension in your nervous system. Making your stress level higher, and more difficult for your body to feel loose and relaxed. That’s fact. That’s how it is, and anybody talking about it in a way that is supporting sustainability and longevity in their martial arts practice.

Brad Scornavacco:
Absolutely. That’s one of the things that appeals to me so much about what you do. I am a professional martial artist. This is my only job — it’s not a hobby for me. I go to the school six days a week and I’m on the mat, I’m training, I’m working with people. I am a professional athlete in the sense that I get paid for my physical abilities, and to teach and interact with students.

I know that my body has to last until I retire, and I don’t want to retire before I need to. I’ve always had it in my mind that I need longevity. My joints need to last. My body needs to last. I need to be healthy and strong, and not be slowly, slowly, slowly getting more and more decrepit every year when I stand in front of my students. I would like to be strong, pliable, and have everything working until I don’t need it anymore.

What you’re talking about of doing these exercises, and going through your program and what you do to make sure that happens. I don’t want to be that person who is in the walker or the wheelchair. I want to be running into the grave.

It sounds like you’ve gotten to the key of what’s going to help people do that. It’s fascinating and it appeals to me. Why don’t you tell me now of some of the results you’ve gotten with other clients and students? What have you done for people?

Bill Parravano:
As you know, my focus with my business is around knee pain. The whole “Knee Pain Guru” online business that I’ve developed. I’ve taken people who have been diagnosed with bone-on-bone, which is considered to be the last stage before they have knee replacement surgery. I’ve been able to coach people on the internet to be able to get to a place where they can go hiking and biking and play with their kid and grandkids, or whatever the case may be.

One specific client in general is Bruce. He was a scientist in Utah, and talk about a skeptic! I’m talking about nervous system, and intangible things you can’t see or understand, and he has this list of things to do.

I gave him a protocol. We checked in once a week, and this is what you need to focus on, and within three to four months he was hiking in the mountains, camping with his son, and riding bikes with his grandson and things like that.

And it’s really cool that people can begin to get their life back as a result of following some simple principles. Simple concepts and ideas of listening to what your body is saying. Instead of beating yourself up more because you couldn’t hike five miles; you were only able to hike one-and-a-half. That’s okay.

We need to come back and see how we can recover better. A big focus in my program is recovery. It’s not about how hard you can train; it’s how fast you can recover, and the more you teach the body to recover, the faster you can get back out on the mat in the dojo or whatever you want to do. That’s the source of the success I’ve had with clients.

There’s another guy, Vinnie, who is a border patrol agent out of Australia, and I started working with him. He had two kneecap dislocations, and as a result, he had surgery after each one of those kneecap dislocations to rebuild the tendon around the kneecap.

The last kneecap dislocation he had was from martial arts training for the border patrol, and he was terrified of losing his job. He wasn’t able to get out in the field anymore. He needed to pass a physical in order to maintain his position.

After working six months with him, we got him where he not only tested out and passed the physical. He tested into a special operations unit that he is now in a remote part of Australia training with. It was 12 weeks of intense training for a special Marine unit that’s a part of his division he’s in that only a few select people get into.

Within a period of six months, he was able to accomplish that, and one of the big things we focused on was his ability to move loose and free in the context of martial arts training. So we were able to accomplish that.

Brad Scornavacco:
I saw you a month or two ago (I want to add my own story, which is kind of what has gotten to what we’re going to be doing). When we were in North Carolina, I had a snowboarding injury. I’m really active outside of the martial arts classes as well, and I separated my shoulder. There was one range of motion – even with all the mobility exercises and everything – where I was getting that sympathetic response, and my body was like this is not good. This was maybe in the course of a half-hour, and I was lucky enough to have your hands on me. You were helping me through that.

I felt the change right there in my body. Part of that is being a martial artist I can feel that happen easily, and I was aware of it. My shoulder hasn’t come back, so it’s not like I did it and then a week later it came back. It hasn’t been back since. I have moved through that range of motion with shoulder, and I am really happy about that because  I’m training and teaching all the time, I need my shoulder, and nobody had fixed it until I got to you.

I started talking to you, and you came across this idea that you wanted to be able to teach martial artists how to do some first aid. What you called it was “The Martial Arts First Aid Kit,” and I thought that was a brilliant idea.

We’re going to do this workshop in February here in Colorado, and you’re going to do a couple days teaching all of the martial artists how to do their own first aid. I’d like you to talk a little bit about what’s going to happen, and what is this idea of “Martial Arts First Aid Kit” all about?

Bill Parravano:
Thanks, Brad. I think the piece that’s really important to understand, is we train martial arts so we can be most impactful when we punch, kick or throw (i.e., the maximum amount of effectiveness with the least amount of input).

When you punch that person, they crumble. When you kick that person, they crumble. It’s like they’re not there. When you throw the person, it feels like they fly over your hip. That’s what we’re looking for in the martial arts.

However, in healing from all of those punches, kicks and throws, martial artists aren’t looking at the ability to heal the very same way. They’re looking at fighting the body to get it to let go, and it doesn’t need be that way.

We’re going to take the same principles and philosophies of martial arts, and apply them to healing of the body. Healing meaning creating that space. Getting the pressure off the nerves, freeing up those old injuries that you had sticking around for weeks, months or years, and working with those in a way that each martial artist that’s showing up can begin to help themselves, and begin to help other people in their club. So they don’t have to have all those dings, limps, shoulder injuries and neck tweaks and stuff like that. There’s something they can begin doing the minute it happens that’s going to speed up the recovery of the body so they can get back on the mat quicker.

Everybody wins because  now the person who’s learning how to do this can get back on the mat faster, as well as if you’re supporting your fellow martial artists. Now you have more people you’re going to be able to train with. They’re not going to miss practice because they’re injured.

Brad Scornavacco:
It’s funny, because I had a Jujitsu teacher who told me, “If you’re going to learn how to choke somebody out, you better know how to revive them.” It made a lot of sense to me. In martial arts you spend all this time practicing and training to hurt people. You’re borrowing each other’s bodies and you’re out there doing all of this. So you’re on the destructive side, and everybody is doing this.

At the same time, you don’t want to hurt each other. But it’s inevitable that if you’re doing an arm bar on somebody or somebody like that, somebody is going to tweak it too much, and the longer you’re training, the more that stuff is going to add up.

Martial arts teachers have it compartmentalized. We’re teaching you how to break the bones, strain ligaments and do all this stuff. But if you need to get healed, then go to the hospital. There’s nothing there for them. They don’t have any knowledge of saying you’re in a class, you tweak this limb, and now here’s what we have to do.

Like what you’re saying:  We need some “Martial Arts First Aid” right here, and we need some simple things they can do. Even if it is a serious injury, before they get somewhere they need to know what to do about it. They kind of have the deer-in-the-headlights things of oh, geez! This person is hurt. What do we do?

I know a lot of martial artists don’t have any kind of standard CPR or first aid or anything like that. Much less this kind of understanding of what you can do to really ramp up the healing process.

Bill Parravano:
That’s exactly the case. The extent of what I’ve seen on a martial arts mat has been somebody busts their eye open or bloodies their nose. I’ve seen compound fractures take place on the mat, and basically it’s just get the person to the hospital. What can we do? Get him an ice pack and drive him to the hospital.

Of course, this is not what I’m talking about. If something is broken or torn, or there’s something significantly wrong, then absolutely doctors need to be called in. You want to get them to the hospital.

But what I’m talking about is the recurring injury, the thing you keep dinging every week. You’re afraid to go in there because of the toe, the ankle, the knee, the hip, the back, the shoulder, the neck – whatever it is. The arm bar you had when you were 24, that now you can’t straighten your arm out all the way.

The (inaudible 30:23) motion in your shoulder that you can’t get into your technique, or you can’t punch correctly anymore because the arm doesn’t work the way it’s supposed to. The shoulder isn’t loose enough. You can’t kick real easy.

Brad Scornavacco:
I’ve got a former student who did 30 years of real hard-style martial arts before he came to train with me. I’m telling you, this guy cannot straighten his elbows. He’s developed arthritis, and he stopped training. I was trying to get him to different healers and people to try to help him. This would be perfect for him. I look at this guy (he’s a postal worker), and I think about this beyond the actual training on the mat. This guy’s walking around with an inability to straighten out his elbows, and it’s from decades of recurring chronic training injuries.

I know he can heal himself. Or have somebody else help him get to a point where he can recover that, and he can actually straighten his arms out. When you come out here I’m going to invite this guy, because he’s a textbook example of somebody who could really benefit from this.

Even if you’re a martial arts professional, you’re in combat a very short period of your life. Maybe a few skirmishes. If you’re a civilian, maybe you have to defend yourself once. If you’re a police officer maybe you’re doing it fairly routinely.

But for the most part, these guys have to live with their body every day, and to be able to recover the way they were born to move is invaluable. You’ve got to live in your body your whole life.

Bill Parravano:
Brad, before we go any further, you talked about arthritis, and one thing I hear a lot is martial artists with arthritis. They had the arm lock. They had the kick to the knee or the hip or whatever it is, and now they’re developing arthritis.

But do you know what one of the medical diagnoses of arthritis is? If the doctor diagnoses you with arthritis, what they will write on that diagnosis?

Brad Scornavacco:
No. What do they write?

Bill Parravano:
They will write that the “joint is dehydrated.” That you have a dehydrated joint. The only way the joint can get dehydrated is if there’s not enough water. So you would think the common sense thing would be to drink more water, which is a component of rehydrating the joint. However, if the joint was injured, you have the body tensing up to protect itself from getting injured further.

Brad Scornavacco:
So it’s making it difficult to get rehydrated.

Bill Parravano:
It can’t rehydrate itself. Just like you can squeeze your fist and the rest of your arm could be relaxed, you open your fist and your hand will turn white. Then it will turn pink. The same thing is going on in the knee, the hip, the spine, the neck, the shoulder, the elbow, the knuckle that has arthritis because  it’s tensing up to protect itself from getting injured further. The joint begins to dehydrate. There’s no more fluid in the joint, so the joint begins to wear.

The doctor takes an x-ray, a CT-Scan or an MRI, and it comes up as arthritis, and they’re like well, you’re just going to have to live with it.

Brad Scornavacco:
I don’t accept that.

Bill Parravano:
Right. But if you address the stress and tension that has developed in the nervous system, and create a localized place of comfort for that joint, you immediately create space. Its relief in the joint takes the pressure off the nerves, and now the water that you’re drinking can actually get into the joint to begin the healing process that the body inherently knows how to do.

Brad Scornavacco:
So somebody who comes and says, “The doctor said I’m dehydrated, so I’m going to drink a gallon of water,” it’s not going to help, because they’re missing that component.

Bill Parravano:
They’re missing the component of the space in the body. As we get older, stress and tension builds up so there’s less and less space for the water to actually be hydrating into the joints. Think of it as a sponge.

Brad Scornavacco:
You said as we get older, that stress and tension build up. Obviously, people that’s just a part of aging. As you get older you’re going to be more stressed and more tense. That’s kind of the standard wisdom:  you just get older and you get tense. So are you saying that’s not destiny?

Bill Parravano:
That’s right. In our martial arts – Systema, the Russian martial arts – most of the people who move poorly are the people who just got in it. The people that are in it longer move better. It’s just the opposite in conventional martial arts. The younger people move better, and as you’re in it longer, they don’t. The tension starts to leave [assumed].

Brad Scornavacco:
I see that all the time. Having a storefront martial art and having a school and people come in, I constantly get people from every martial art on the planet that you’ve heard of, and martial arts you haven’t heard of, and invariably it’s the case that the ones who have doing it longer, you can see they’re moving worse. In Systema we usually get them from they don’t understand how to move at all, to that place of space and freedom.

Again, that’s why I think these two things fit like a hand and a glove. What you’re talking about when you’re doing it and your principles with Systema in particular, personally I think everybody who learns Systema should be doing this because  in Systema a lot of people who are in different healing modalities come in, but a lot of people aren’t, and the only healing they’re learning is they understand that there’s got to be relaxation, and getting rid of this restriction.

But I think there’s a missing component. I think what you have is something that will really, really benefit in particular Systema practitioners and instructors if they haven’t gone through massage school or Rolfing or Feldenkrais or anything else, and they just want to know how to heal each other.

I think what you’re doing is going to give them that system behind it that will help clarify what they’re doing. Instead of indiscriminately standing on people and saying it’s going to heal you. I think you can give them more of that understanding of the principles behind this, so they can go into each other with somebody and say maybe I’m not going to roll all over him, and put five people on him to heal him. He needs this. That’s something that appealed to me with going through it myself, and I think it’s fantastic.

To wrap up, you have videos on the internet where you’re working on people’s knee injury real-time. I’ve seen some of these myself, where you’re taking them through everything right there, and they’re giving you the results where they can feel it themselves and actually start to recover. That’s really impressive.

If people want to see what you do, they can go to your website: www.thekneepainguru.com?

Bill Parravano:
That’s correct.

Brad Scornavacco:
www.thekneepainguru.com. You can check out Bill’s site, and he’s got a free report you can get. I think even YouTube where he’s got a bunch of clips of his work, so you can see what he’s going to do.

But if you really want to see what he’s going to do and you don’t want to do it online, come to Colorado. He’s going to be here February 18th and 19th. We’re going to do two days where Bill is going to take my martial arts students, myself and anybody who’s invited (it’s open to the public) take them through it joint-by-joint. Right?

Bill Parravano:
Yes. We’re going to work through the body, and show how you can begin to relieve that tension. When you take the pressure off the nerves, the results are immediate. So it’s not something that is going to be in theory, because there’s going to be notetaking. This is going to be hands-on. We’re going to be on the mat.

What can you begin to do right now that you’re going to walk out at the end of the weekend feeling considerably looser and more free in your body.

Brad Scornavacco:
I’m really looking forward to it. I’m one of those life-long learners. I like the fact that you’re going to give the principles behind it. Like you said, if I go to you and say fix me, and then I leave, I think that’s the ‘give the man a fish’ thing. You’re really going to teach everybody how to do it. So when you’re going, everybody can continue to work with each other and help themselves. I’m really excited about that.

Like I said, if you’re listening and you want to go to thekneepainguru.com – if you want to get in touch with Bill for anything – you can do that and get hold of him.

If you’re interested in coming to the seminar, my website is www.systemacolorado.com, and you can do that. If you want to get into the seminar you can call my assistant, Michelle. The number for us is (303) 485-5425. You can get hold of her and I can get you guys enrolled, because the seminar has limited space, and a bunch of my students already are looking forward to this and have enrolled. They’re already on it, so it’s going to be a great time.

I invite everybody to come on down. If you can make it to Colorado, it’s a beautiful time to be here. You can come and ski and train. It’s going to be a really good time. If you’re interested in that first aid for martial arts training, this is the place to be.

Bill, I’d like to say thanks for taking the time to talk to me about this, so people can learn a little bit more about what it is that you’re doing. I hope to see people there. Anything else to add?

Bill Parravano:
Brad, it was really fun doing the interview, and I’m really looking forward to the seminar.

Brad Scornavacco:
Thanks, and I guess I’ll talk to everybody next time. See you, guys.